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Author Topic: The Rose Garden  (Read 55715 times)

Offline Boris

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #30 on: February 05, 2007, 01:45:12 PM »
Boris, what rose is that???

I don't know really. I took the picture last summer in City Garden. Asked my hubby who own the florists's shop and he didn't know either. Pretty, though.
"A theater is the most important sort of house in the world, because that's where people are shown what they could be if they wanted, and what they'd liked to be if they dared, and what they really are." -Tove Jansson-

Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #31 on: February 05, 2007, 05:26:45 PM »

Great Thread


The only roses that work for me are the "found" antiques such as the Martha Gonzales.  (the pic is from the net, but i'll take one when it gets going.)  No care needed for this baby and very manageble.

"Martha Gonzales" was found by Pam Puryear in Navasota, TX at the home of Martha Gonzales in 1982, and introduced by the Antique Rose Emporium in 1991.   
"Martha Gonzales" is a small twiggy 2' - 4' China rose with single bright scarlet flowers. Its foliage is a unique shade of dark gray-green, and the new growth is dark red.
It is an excellent choice for a low hedge or mass plantings, and has become very popular with landscapes.



Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #32 on: February 05, 2007, 05:28:59 PM »
I know it's hard to identify just by looking, but I posted this pic a couple weeks ago, this rose seems to bloom year round.




Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #33 on: February 05, 2007, 06:27:33 PM »
http://www.rosefarm.ca/

http://www.hortico.com/

http://uncommonrose.biz/r/unusual.html

Ok these are the 3 I've ordered from this year. I had been bored to death with plants, half decided that i was NOT going to do anything regarding my old profession here in Denver. And I may still hold with that...but not plant at home?? who am i kidding


There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it

Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #34 on: February 05, 2007, 06:30:00 PM »
I'm wondering if that gorgeous pink rose  you posted is Mary Rose, or another of the Austin/English roses cabin.

I have a block against David Austin's roses, don't ask why, dates from my days at the Brooklyn Botanic garden. But he does have some gorgeous blooms, doesn't he?
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it

Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #35 on: February 05, 2007, 06:36:19 PM »
And the found antiques? you are right--half the now famous old roses we have  were once unknown. they got so lost, people spent years figuring out which one they were. A lot came from cemetaries, an enormous number came from the farms of black farmers in the US south--they took clippings and planted them before the civil war. In Europe a lot came from old manor estates and castle gardns, some in ruins for 100 years and more but the roses still survived. Throve on neglect.
Martha Gonzales has always been one of my favorite mysteries. Plus there is one they found by an old mine camp in california, obviously a French hybrid, a complex one, but nobody knows what it is--clusters, white, smells like lemons, has obvious damask and alba and god know what else.
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it

Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #36 on: February 05, 2007, 06:57:56 PM »
I think you've hit it right.   The left pic is mine, the identified Mary Rose on the Right is off the net.    Pretty close match, I think.

   

Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #37 on: February 05, 2007, 06:59:46 PM »


Rosa gallica 'officianalis', the legendary Apothecary's Rose.

I love the color of this one.

Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #38 on: February 05, 2007, 07:04:51 PM »
Supposing anybody reads this, what do you think of the gallica roses?

I thought I'd post examples of different categories one at a time, say gallica today, Damask over the weekend, etc.

Have fun, this can be a very good thread!

Excellent and a lot of fun.  The variety of color, stripped, petal volume variety from the simplest to the most complicated looking ones.  A great array of attributes.

This thread can be an excellent resource for information regarding where one can buy these.

This reminds me of where I grew up in south texas.  My mother, homemaker as most women in the neighborhood were, traded cutting of all kinds with her friends.  Pretty soon, all the gardens up and down the streets looked the same.   lol.   But never fear, a new cutting of something or other would infiltrate the neighborhood and by the time you knew it, everyone had the most handsome specimens available.

Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #39 on: February 05, 2007, 07:06:02 PM »
yeah me too. I love the antiquity of some of these roses. Because aside from the very oldest, they all had to be taken from cuttings. We ARE looking at the same plant viewed by Napoleon, or Franz Josef or our great great grandparents.

I wouldn't say dead certain, but if nothing else it's 99% an Austin rose, and that same 99% could be Mary rose. We would have to count petals, look at leaf structure and stamens to be sure, but i will go with mary rose <GRIN>
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it

Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #40 on: February 05, 2007, 07:07:08 PM »
]How about a really interesting ross to close off for now?

Check this one out, named Lyla Banks:


It's a shrub about 3x4 and for some reason reminds me of a clematis

Now that is different.    And can see why it would remind you of that.

Offline cabin

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #41 on: February 05, 2007, 07:11:03 PM »
yeah me too. I love the antiquity of some of these roses. Because aside from the very oldest, they all had to be taken from cuttings. We ARE looking at the same plant viewed by Napoleon, or Franz Josef or our great great grandparents.

I wouldn't say dead certain, but if nothing else it's 99% an Austin rose, and that same 99% could be Mary rose. We would have to count petals, look at leaf structure and stamens to be sure, but i will go with mary rose <GRIN>

[grin back at ya] -- I'll just pick the name that suits me the best until someone else counts petals.  lol -- I'll take Mary rose for now.  Thanks

Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #42 on: February 05, 2007, 07:41:28 PM »
I need to post another rose today, so how about my personal favorite ? <no ego here lol>

I don't like the post 1945 hybrid tea roses much--they are overbred pieces of frippery which simply don't perform well as PLANTS, plus they give the rose a bad name. Why? They have so many diseases. They are afflicted by everything under the sun, or so it seems.  Now, the OLDER older hybrid tea roses are much healthier. Today's have been overbred to the point of exhaustion. They are like inbred people in far too many ways. This is the one rose whose name most people know, which is it's glory and downfall all at once. It is far too popular for the aesthaetes. " A common Plant..." was how i heard it described once, and just giggled. the fellow with his nose in the air must have thought I was crazy but WTF.
Peace is spectacular. It has needs for fertilizer and sun--but not too MUCH sun or you lose the delicacy of its' shading. A place with 'high shade' in the sense of shade from a large tree pruned HIGH, hitting it at the height of the day, but not too close to that tree or you get nothing worth the time spent siting it.  When well grown the blooms are huge. I had a plant in NY which somehow or other managed to close the rose season: just before frost it would send out one <1> absolutely huge delicate flower, year after year. I dont think it is especially susceptable to black spot or mildew or any of the other things the anti-peace people say about it. It is one damned good french rose.

A bit on its' breeding:

On June 15, 1935, French hybridizer Francis Meilland cross-pollinated two
roses ((George Dickson x Souv. de Claudius Pernet) x (Joanna Hill x Charles P. Kilham)) x Margaret McGredy, from which was born the following year a weak seedling of dubious qualities. But, a few eyes were budded in 1936, and by fall one of the plants had developed into an especially fine specimen with lush dark green, glossy foliage, and it had
magnificent blooms of the most delicate ivory-yellow brushed with pink at the edges.

Ok that was peace. here are some pics culled from the web. If I posted mine, people would accuse me of using photoshop, that's how good peace is.







IMO only the first picture really starts to capture the beauty of Peace. And it's still not that good a picture. Peace is  gorgeous. I'll dig out the disc which has my own pictures of peace  and post those if I ever find the damned thing. Just don't go saying i photoshopped it lolol!

But this is the one rose almost everyone has seen, or grown, so you probably know how beautiful it IS already!
« Last Edit: February 06, 2007, 03:59:36 AM by brokeback_1 »
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it

Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #43 on: February 06, 2007, 03:02:34 AM »
Couldn't sleep, so here are some more roses, in the ALBA class. But first, I found this info tonight on a site called rosegathering, and it has good basic info on this class. In legend if not fact, the alba rose---I believe it was Rosa alba x semi-plena--gave England one of her names: Albion, "Land of the White Roses". For many years people accepted that as fact but the theory has been debunked. Oh well--it's still a lovely thought!

http://www.rosegathering.com/albas.html




Alba Roses are hybrids whose antiquity may go back further than the Roman Empire. Pliny, who lived from 23-79 A.D., mentioned white roses in his Natural History. Botanists believe these roses may have been Albas.

Graham Thomas supports Dr. C. C. Hurst's theory that Albas are derived from the dog rose, Rosa canina, and the Damask rose, Rosa damascena. (More on this can be found in The Graham Stuart Thomas Rose Book).

Albas make elegant upright shrubs with beautiful blue-green foliage, which some may call grey. Botanists have differentiated the Albas from other roses by their grey, scentless leaflets. They only bloom in spring. They have delicate coloring ranging from white through exquisite soft shades of pink. They have a penetrating pure rosy fragrance with tones of citrus. They are resistant to disease for the most part. Many can tolerate shade, drought, and are winter hardy.

Christopher Brickell suggests pruning Albas like Centifolias, Mosses, and most Damasks. He groups these roses together because they mainly flower on short lateral and sublateral shoots produced from second-year or older wood. These roses also regularly produce vigorous basal or near-basal shoots, which may grow 5-8 feet in one season. He suggests tipping back unripe or damaged shoots in the first year. For the second and following years, he suggests cutting back long new basal growths by up to one-third in February or March. He notes that care must be taken not to cut back the new shoots too much or the elegant arched habit can be lost. He also recommends cutting back laterals on flowered shoots to 2-3 eyes or 4-6 inches. It is also a good idea to cut out any badly placed shoots. In addition, summer dead-heading and tipping back extra-long growths to minimize wind-rock is encouraged in September to November.
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it

Offline Brokeback_1

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Re: The Rose Garden
« Reply #44 on: February 06, 2007, 03:06:23 AM »
Roas alba x 'maxima'




class: Alba Rose
synonyms: R. x alba 'Maxima'
breeding: before 1500
photographed by Daphne Filiberti in her garden

The below info was taken from The Rose Gathering, on the internet. It is NOT mine and the web address is listed in the previous post--just want to give Daphne her credit!!!

'Alba Maxima' is close to an archetypal white rose; it is also one of the oldest roses grown in gardens today. Boccaccio (1313-1375), writer of the Decameron, was quoted by Julia Cartwright in Italian Gardens of the Renaissance. Boccaccio described the beautiful gardens near Rome: "the beauties of these gardens, of the broad alleys shaded by pergolas laden with purple grapes, and bordered with red and white roses and jessamine". There is a good chance the white roses that Boccaccio spoke of were either 'Alba Maxima' or 'Alba Semi-Plena', which still embellish Florentine gardens to this day. 'Alba Maxima' was painted by Italian masters of the fifteenth century. This might be due to the fact that 'Alba Maxima' is a beautiful white rose, which could symbolize the definitive white rose. E.Y. Bunyard believed that 'Alba Maxima', as well as 'Maiden's Blush', was painted in The Birth of Venus by Botticelli. 'Alba Maxima' also appears in many Dutch masterpeices of the eighteenth century. There has been a good share of debate over whether 'Alba Maxima' is the Rose of York, a symbol of English political power. Some experts believe The Rose of York refers to 'Alba Semi-Plena', while Graham Thomas believes it is probably Rosa arvensis. 'Alba Maxima' can sport to 'Alba Semi-Plena' and 'Alba Semi-Plena' can sport to 'Alba Maxima' and this can account for some of the confusion about these roses. 'Alba Maxima' is like a fuller version of 'Semi-Plena'. Jack Harkness wrote that the history of 'Maxima' was lost in the eighteenth and early ninteenth century. What is certain is that the rose is a noble white rose, with many other names such as 'The Jacobite Rose', 'Great Double White', 'The Bonnie Prince Charlie's Rose'. Redouté's Rosa alba flore pleno is 'Alba Semi-Plena'. There are stories of 'Alba Maxima' still surviving for many years in a place where a home once stood. The rose can tolerate some severe conditions. I have had my rose planted in partial shade for over five years. It didn't bloom for a couple of years in my Southern California garden. The rose is a stately six feet tall and it fills up nicely with white, loosely double, scented flowers. In December I love the hips, which are a beautiful red oval shape. 'Alba Semi-Plena' is supposed to be more fragrant than 'Alba Maxima', but I find 'Alba Maxima' to be wonderfully fragrant. I look forward to my roses from 'Alba Maxima' once a year. They are nicely scented of damask and citrus, even tangerine tones. The rose is healthy, with beautiful foliage, that has a blue glow. It is about six feet high, upright, and V-shaped.
« Last Edit: February 07, 2007, 12:27:16 AM by brokeback_1 »
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe but nothing could be done about it, & if you can't fix it, you've got to stand it