Columbine

[Nikki]

I know this is a terrible thought, but I keep thinking of Homer Hickam, (for all you people who have seen our beloved Jake Gyllenhaal in October Sky), who really was making space rockets in his basement as a boy.

Janjo,I remember the film.  Of course, Hickam lived in a small town, and it seems in those days one didn't hear of such horrific things as we hear of now.  Also, Hickam and his friends went to the outskirts to try out their experiments.  BTW 'October Sky' was a very good, heartwarming film -- it was shown in the middle schools, and my granddaughters loved it when they were in middle school.

[dejavu]

I know this is a terrible thought, but I keep thinking of Homer Hickam, (for all you people who have seen our beloved Jake Gyllenhaal in October Sky), who really was making space rockets in his basement as a boy.

That thought did cross my mind, too, Jess.  Of course, those really were rockets without any intent to harm anyone (although they certainly could have) but "kid making rockets" brought Homer to mind.

[janjo]

A lovely film, a great book, and seemingly a very nice man.
It is rather reassuring to know that not all students who are constructing things in the basement, or here where on the whole we don't have basements, in the shed, are up to no good.

[Desecra]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/sep/02/manchester-teenagers-columbine-style-attack

[janjo]

Des, you posted that before I did!

It is very chilling, and the descriptions that were given of the mental state of the two boys concerned sounded so similar to Harris and Kleibold that it was extraordinary. One a depressive and the other with a vengeful fascination with violence.
We must be so grateful to the friend that telephoned the police, and that they were picked up before they could act.

[Desecra]

They were cleared today.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/sep/16/columbine-manchester-swift-mcknight

Maybe this sort of thing (teenagers fantasising about and plotting violence) is more common than we think, and it really is extremely difficult to spot the real danger.   (Maybe it's also difficult to prosecute early in the proceedings even when there is a risk.   Or maybe prosecution is the wrong route at that stage).  

[Monica LoveEmBoys]

Wow, Des --  What a surprising turn of events.

This really brings to my mind the discussions of what could have happened to intervene in Columbine.  What if the parents HAD searched their rooms and found the journals, the plans, the bomb making materials...  Obviously there still is a considerable leap from a moody teenager engaging in violent fantasies to one actually planning to take action.     How discouraging.

[janjo]

They were cleared today.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/sep/16/columbine-manchester-swift-mcknight

Maybe this sort of thing (teenagers fantasising about and plotting violence) is more common than we think, and it really is extremely difficult to spot the real danger.   (Maybe it's also difficult to prosecute early in the proceedings even when there is a risk.   Or maybe prosecution is the wrong route at that stage).  

I was pretty gobsmacked by this, Des. Of course we weren't in court to hear the evidence. Teenage boys are obsessed with blowing things up, and from what I have seen at work, nuclear explosions,................ but even so.
Presumably because they were acquitted no further action can be taken. I would like to think that someone, somewhere, in social services is at least keeping an eye on them. 

[Desecra]

I don't know if I'd have been any clearer even if I'd been in court.   Dave's book was very enlightening, but I still don't feel I understand enough.    And it got me thinking - supppose one of them had been found to be a psychopath, would that make any difference?   Would he be more "guilty" or more of a risk? 

[michaelflanagansf]

Dylan Klebold's mom speaks in "O" magazine
"No inkling" of plans for Columbine massacre
By The Denver Post
Posted: 10/10/2009 01:00:00 AM MDT

An essay by the mother of Columbine killer Dylan Klebold says she had "no inkling" of her son's inner turmoil, and her examination of his journals has prompted her to learn about suicide in an effort to understand the school shooting.

The essay by Susan Klebold, which appears in the November issue of O, The Oprah Magazine, explores her son's role in the 1999 massacre where he and co-conspirator Eric Harris killed 12 students and a teacher and left two dozen wounded before killing themselves.

Neither family has spoken at length in the aftermath of what at the time marked the most deadly school shooting in U.S. history. Pending litigation contributed to the silence for several years, but even with the lawsuits resolved, repeated requests for interviews have been turned down.

In a news release, Oprah Winfrey also noted that Susan Klebold had declined interview requests but then, several months ago, agreed to write about her personal experience. The magazine released a few advance excerpts.

"From the writings Dylan left behind, criminal psychologists have concluded that he was depressed and suicidal," Susan Klebold wrote in one passage. "When I first saw copied pages of these writings, they broke my heart. I'd had no inkling of the battle Dylan was waging in his mind."

continues:

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_13530104?source=rss

[killersmom]

Thanks for posting this Michael. It is interesting in her own words.

[janjo]

Hopefully this will do some good. Far too little attention is paid to childhood and adolescent depression, yet ignoring it can lead to such terrible consequences.

[killersmom]

Columbine parents react to essay by shooter's mom

Tue Oct 13, 8:55 pm ET

DENVER – Parents and survivors of the 1999 massacre at Columbine High School are saying good things about an essay released by the mother of shooter Dylan Klebold.

Susan Klebold made the most detailed public remarks since the attack by any parent of the two Columbine killers in an essay released Tuesday and published in O, The Oprah Magazine.

In the essay, Klebold says she had "no inkling" her son was suicidal or depressed.

The essay sparked strong emotions for Connie Michalik. Her son, Richard Castaldo, was shot and partially paralyzed in the rampage.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091014/ap_on_re_us/us_columbine_mother_s_essay_1

[michaelflanagansf]

Couldn't help but think about Columbine when I read this - hopefully this sort of thing will help parents and communities get a heads up in advance:

Potential for criminal behavior evident at age 3
Rachael Myers Lowe
Reuters

NEW YORK (Reuters Health) – Children who don't show normal fear responses to loud, unpleasant sounds at the age of 3 may be more likely to commit crimes as adults, according to a new study.

Yu Gao and colleagues in the United States and the United Kingdom compared results from a study of almost 1,800 children born in 1969 and 1970 on the Indian Ocean island of Mauritius to criminal records of group members 20 years later.

At age 3, the children were tested to gauge their level of "fear conditioning," or fear of consequences. The idea is that children who associate unpleasant sounds or other unpleasant experiences with fear will be less likely to commit antisocial acts because they will link such experiences with punishments for those acts.

Researchers tested the 3-year-olds' responses to unpleasant noises using a lie detector. When they looked at any criminal records among the participants 20 years later, 137 of them (131 male, 6 female) had at least one criminal conviction.

Compared to almost 300 participants with no criminal records, those 137 participants had a much lower response to the noises at the age of 3.

The findings could link previous studies suggesting that psychopaths and children with behavioral problems at the age of 11 have similar abnormalities in a part of the brain called the amygdala. That structure is largely responsible for directing fear of consequences.

continues:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20091116/hl_nm/us_criminal_behavior

[Nikki]

Michael, very interesting article and also very chilling.  Who would think of looking for anything offbeat in a 3 year old? Usually, if a child doesn't react to loud noises, the first thought is deafness.