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Author Topic: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed  (Read 32703 times)

Offline AshesOnBrokeback

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #30 on: April 30, 2014, 11:05:36 AM »
Finally checked out Enemy Sunday, just getting around to giving my thoughts on it.

Enemy was definitely nice. One thing I kept noticing was Jake's facial features, on several occasions the camera angle on his face made me totally not care what was going on in the story and just care about that angle because he was really smoldering (but that's just Jake I suppose lol). This movie had an independent film vibe but Jake's look and presence really gave it a lot of appeal for me. About the story, I felt it was sort of a surreal experience, Jake's character (the professor) was in the film having a surreal experience about an actor that looked like him, and it's surreal for the audience to me because we're watching someone that we're familiar with searching the Internet for pictures of someone who is an actor who looks like Jake Gyllenhaal :D ...At first I thought this movie would turn out like Fight Club and Jake would turn out to be living two lives unconsciously, but it didn't. However, the whole spider on the tray in the beginning was a part of some type of club apparently. Honestly I didn't get exactly what the spider throughout the film represents, but it set a dark tone that I really enjoyed, the final scene was frightening and excited, I also liked it because I didn't know to what make of it, I could grasps for a meaning by forming one myself, but sometimes I like watching a movie and not fully understanding it or knowing what it meant, I usually get more insight years later which is something I like. Oh yeah, and again, Jake was Hot in this picture. ;D

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Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #31 on: April 30, 2014, 06:22:59 PM »
seems that most people are glad to have seen the movie.

Offline Sienna

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #32 on: April 30, 2014, 09:28:58 PM »
i did not know exactly what the spider meant either, but my gut feeling is that it somehow symbolized women.

i was never sure exactly what was going on with Anthony and Adam either. Were they two separate people really, or did they just think they were?

Did Anthony and Adam's girl friend really die in that car wreck, or was that just Adam's way of ending that wild part of his life and accepting his life with his pregnant wife (who maybe he felt trapped with/afraid of/ hence the spider)

just some random thoughts...

Offline oilgun

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #33 on: April 30, 2014, 10:06:11 PM »
i did not know exactly what the spider meant either, but my gut feeling is that it somehow symbolized women.

i was never sure exactly what was going on with Anthony and Adam either. Were they two separate people really, or did they just think they were?

Did Anthony and Adam's girl friend really die in that car wreck, or was that just Adam's way of ending that wild part of his life and accepting his life with his pregnant wife (who maybe he felt trapped with/afraid of/ hence the spider)

just some random thoughts...

Very interesting!  I figured that the Adam-Anthony characters were an id-ego thing but I didn't get the meaning of the spider imagery.  I was hoping that those who read the book could shed some light into the matter.
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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #34 on: May 01, 2014, 12:25:07 AM »
Very interesting!  I figured that the Adam-Anthony characters were an id-ego thing but I didn't get the meaning of the spider imagery.  I was hoping that those who read the book could shed some light into the matter.


I've read the book, but I'm just as confused...  :D

There are some 'Enemy explained' videos on YouTube - here's one of them:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9AWkqRwd1I

I'll post some of my thoughts later.
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Offline Sienna

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #35 on: May 01, 2014, 07:44:52 AM »
i'm not sure i want to watch the video explanation yet. i'm not sure why. i guess i like feeling around for myself about what i think it means and talking to other peeps who've watched it.

so what do you guys think: were Adam and Anthony two distinct people who just looked alike?? or was one of them the alter-ego of the other one?

if so, who was the real person, or what was the real combo of traits that made up the real person??

what about the picture that Adam had of him with a girl torn out, that was in a frame on Anthony's bookshelf with the girl intact? that is the one thing that really makes me think they were the same person.

when Adam's girlfriend confront's Anthony about his wedding band tan, i wonder if that's yet another way that Adam's mind is starting to sever his connection with her...

the thing about her is - she's blond and beautiful and she shows up at his place and drinks and hangs out and wants sex, but she makes no demands on him and doesn't even bother him with idle chit chat. then he goes to bed when he wants to and they have sex. until that last time, when things are beginning to fall apart for Adam (ie: he's had to start facing Anthony) and then she rejects him in bed.

more random thoughts....

Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #36 on: May 01, 2014, 01:32:14 PM »
i'm not sure i want to watch the video explanation yet. i'm not sure why. i guess i like feeling around for myself about what i think it means and talking to other peeps who've watched it.

Okay - I couldn't resist watching it after I'd seen the film, but that's just me  ;D  I'm still confused enough as it is, so watching the explanation hasn't changed much...  :D

so what do you guys think: were Adam and Anthony two distinct people who just looked alike?? or was one of them the alter-ego of the other one?

if so, who was the real person, or what was the real combo of traits that made up the real person??

I think we can assume one (Anthony) is the alter-ego. However, I saw them as two different people the first time I watched the film, and in a strange way I still do. Don't know why exactly. Must be Jake's remarkable acting...

It does make sense for Adam to dream about being a 'third rate actor' (= Anthony), like his mother says. His life isn't very exiting, he's bored and depressed. To me, he (Adam) was the main character of the film, the "real person" as you put it.

what about the picture that Adam had of him with a girl torn out, that was in a frame on Anthony's bookshelf with the girl intact? that is the one thing that really makes me think they were the same person.

That girl is Helen, Anthony's wife. That is one of the scenes that really puzzles me. It proves that they are the same person, but I can't quite figure out how it works.

when Adam's girlfriend confront's Anthony about his wedding band tan, i wonder if that's yet another way that Adam's mind is starting to sever his connection with her...

Maybe, yes.

the thing about her is - she's blond and beautiful and she shows up at his place and drinks and hangs out and wants sex, but she makes no demands on him and doesn't even bother him with idle chit chat. then he goes to bed when he wants to and they have sex. until that last time, when things are beginning to fall apart for Adam (ie: he's had to start facing Anthony) and then she rejects him in bed.

I think she rejects him earlier on. Each time they have sex, she gets up or leaves and Adam's alone in bed, feeling miserable. Their sex is always violent, not tender. I think she does  want tenderness, but Adam's not able to give it to her.

more random thoughts....

I'm still totally puzzled by the mother. Her comments are totally opposite in the message on Adam's voicemail ("I worry about you. How can you live like that?") and during their meeting ("You have a respectable job, a nice apartment"). One thing that made me laugh was her "The last thing you need is meeting strange men in hotel rooms" comment - it made me think of Jack and Ennis!  :D
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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #37 on: May 01, 2014, 01:45:07 PM »
Very interesting!  I figured that the Adam-Anthony characters were an id-ego thing but I didn't get the meaning of the spider imagery.  I was hoping that those who read the book could shed some light into the matter.

Unfortunately, the spider issue isn't in the book, so we'll have to figure it out for ourselves...

i did not know exactly what the spider meant either, but my gut feeling is that it somehow symbolized women.

Most reviewers seem to agree on that.
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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #38 on: May 01, 2014, 02:14:02 PM »
Just read this review on a Dutch movie site. Yay! The words "Jake Gyllenhaal" and "Oscar" in one sentence... again!  ;D

"Jake Gyllenhaal is magnifiek en weergaloos (eigenlijk als vanouds) in zijn dubbelrol; voor mij mag hij eind van dit jaar voor een Oscar genomineerd worden."

... and the next reviewer just goes like - "come on man, get real"  :D


Very mixed reviews. Very  mixed. Some call it a masterpiece. Others just don't get it. People even argue how terrific / awesome / horrible / awful the film is. Love that!
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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #39 on: May 04, 2014, 04:40:10 AM »
I think this reviewer got it!  :)


"Obviously, Enemy is not for everyoneÖ and certainly not for the deeply arachnophobic. Many will find it impenetrable. Some may find it just too preposterous. And itís totally fair to think that the ending is just a big ďfuck you!Ē to the audience. But I happen to enjoy this sort of puzzle-box movie, a film that may not ever be completely solvable."

"As you might expect, Enemy  leaves many questions unanswered. (Most of them, actually.) Are Anthony and Adam twins separated at birth? Clones? Two halves of the same manís psyche? Itís hard not to notice that theyíre both involved with beautiful, icy blondes. Adamís mother seems to know more than she lets on, especially when she insists that he likes blueberries when we know itís Anthony who likes blueberries. [...] Jake Gyllenhaal  gives two compelling performances, establishing him further as leading man material as he matures as an actor, and Sarah Gadon  is equally compelling as Helen, who finds herself drawn to her husbandís bashful double."

http://hardinthecity.com/2014/04/02/enemy-review/

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Online Uli

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #40 on: May 11, 2014, 11:12:44 PM »
Uli, I don't know if you're still reading here? I forgot to answer this question:

 :"> :">

Yes, I am... But most evenings I don't have enough energy to switch on my computer and posting from my Ipod is not much fun... :D :D

And thanks for all your posts!! :)

Saw the poster for enemy at a local cinema here...  ;D

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I forget I'm cold and crying
When your lips touch mine and I lose control
I forget I'm old and dying

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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #41 on: May 14, 2014, 01:30:08 PM »
Yes, I am... But most evenings I don't have enough energy to switch on my computer and posting from my Ipod is not much fun... :D :D

No need to apologize!  :-*

Found another interview with Denis on how he and Jake collaborated on creating Adam and Anthony. Interesting how he says the character of Anthony was closer to Jake - and then he calls Anthony a "narcissist"   :D


Q: "The art of playing two characters interests me, especially in that you don't want Adam and Anthony to be too similar or they'll blend together but they also can't be overly distinct or the film's philosophy might not work. How did you direct Jake to find the balance between the two?"

"It was something that was very important. We started to work with the teacher (Adam), and we got very comfortable in the shoes of the teacher. And the teacher was very precise in our head. Anthony was closer to Jake in some ways. And when he came on set for the first time, it was too different. Jake could easily make 25 characters. He's a strong actor. For me, my job was to make them more similar. Just the way he breathes or the way he walks or moves his shoulders, he could become one character or the other. The same body but two different souls. My job was to make them as close as possible in some ways. It was really a matter that one character is afraid of the world and the other is a narcissist. Those ideas were so strong in Jake's mind but I had to slow him down all the time."

http://www.rogerebert.com/interviews/the-horror-of-identity-with-enemy-director-denis-villeneuve

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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #42 on: May 25, 2014, 12:28:49 PM »
'Enemy' now even has its own Dutch Facebook page - but it seems that page isn't moderated at all. People leave stupid, insulting comments on how awful the movie is, on how they don't get it and that it's a waste of time and money - and even a waste of Jake's talent.

Well, we all have our own opinion and of course there are those who dislike 'Enemy'. But why bother to post that on its own Facebook page? That page is for people who like  the movie  >:( 
The joys of social media. Sigh. The good thing about it is that most people on Facebook aren't even able to read Dutch, so...  >:D

I can honestly say I haven't read as many negative comments on any of Jake's films - and the hate for 'Enemy' seems to get worse as more people get to see it. On Amazon, it has more 1-star-reviews than 5-star-reviews, and I haven't seen that for many movies.
Early on, I think 'Enemy' was considered more "European", more arthouse to be appreciated by some American audiences, but now it seems a lot of Europeans aren't too fond of it as well  :(

I still love it, though  :)  And you know what? Maybe all those people should've read the book first  ;)  It does  make sense once you've read the book - sort of...  ;D 



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Offline BlueJeanJeannie

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #43 on: May 27, 2014, 09:42:27 AM »
After having read quite a bit of hate for the film in the last couple of days, this is just about the most enthousiastic review I could find online  :)   I guess it shows it's all a matter of taste:


"I watched Enemy and was simply blown away by every part of it. It hit me harder than any film has hit me for the longest time and I could not get it out of my mind for days after, knowing I absolutely had to watch it again before I even dare share my thoughts. On a first watch it was scary, unnerving, disturbing, and utterly compelling, with a final shot which saw me audibly yell out.

A few weeks later, I was ready to watch the film again, prepared to write a review which I hoped would see my thought appear just as positive the second time around. On a rewatch Enemy is every bit as scary, unnerving, disturbing, a utterly compelling. It is a film of extreme cinematic brilliance, the likes of which we so seldom see and one which I cannot compare to anything Iíve seen. I am enthralled with the film and have no hesitations regarding it as modern masterpiece; a term I rarely use for modern pictures."


Extreme cinematic brilliance? A modern masterpiece? Wow  ;)


And:

"This isnít really a review; itís a call to action. You must see Enemy if you love movies. You owe it to yourself to track down a cinema showing it, a download, or pre-order it online if the opportunity passes you by. Iíve seen it twice and have no doubt Iíll watch it again before the year is through because it really is that good. Trust me when I say a 2014 release which will stick in your mind as long as Enemy does is as likely as seeing meeting your exact double."

http://www.flickeringmyth.com/2014/05/second-opinion-enemy-2013.html
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Offline AshesOnBrokeback

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Re: Enemy Discussion Thread - Spoilers Allowed
« Reply #44 on: May 27, 2014, 09:59:44 AM »
Jake wholly made Enemy work for me, I feel like it's an independent film that was just meant for him. Not his crowning achievement or the first film I would direct someone to who had no previous onscreen Jake experience, but if anything it's primarily a film for already established Jake Gyllenhaal fans...with a chance that some outside of that group will enjoy it as well.

Art is meant to be for anybody to able to enjoy it, but like all art there's usually a segment or segments of the general public that will enjoy it. I feel Enemy is for the Jake Gyllenhaal fan segment of the general public...;D
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