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Author Topic: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays & the military--ARCHIVED  (Read 102405 times)

Offline Lola

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #45 on: October 23, 2006, 12:03:33 PM »
Actor and model Reichen Lehmkuhl, who won season four of The Amazing Race and dates Lance Bass, was sexually assaulted while in the U.S. Air Force, he says.

Lehmkuhl, 32, tells ABC News that when he entered the Air Force Academy, he had to hide his homosexuality under the military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy. But his sexual orientation was the subject of speculation until one night, he says, when he was sent a message.

"A bag was put over my head," he says. "I was stripped of my clothes. I was forced to do things sexually with two other male cadets."

http://people.aol.com/people/article/0,26334,1549383,00.html
 
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Offline ImEnnisShesJack

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #46 on: November 25, 2006, 06:58:20 PM »
Dave has an important announcement about the forum, which he asks all members to read:

http://davecullen.com/forum/index.php?topic=18085.msg602098#msg602098

We have set up a thread to discuss the situation. That discussion thread is linked from the post directly below the message from Dave. Follow the above link and you'll get to both.

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Offline estefue

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #47 on: December 20, 2006, 06:03:37 PM »
Please note following announcement

The administration has been working extremely hard to solve the slow down issue that has been plaguing the forum for some months now. It has been determined that to solve this we will have to change the host company of the forum. The new host server has now been contracted with by Dave as of today.

We are proceeding rapidly now and hope to have the conversion complete within a few weeks at the latest and hopefully much sooner. We will keep you (members) apprised. Please look for announcements in the Newsbox. Some changes will likely come up suddenly--that is the nature of computer conversions, so it is impossible to know before we test whether something will go flawlessly and take two hours, or uncover thorny issues that will take days. The testing process is being started. This will not affect the forum at this point.

So taking this into consideration, we don't want to give you timeframes that are unrealistic. As soon as we finish a stage, we'll proceed immediately to the next, and the exact changeover will likely come on very short notice to you (members). We will post this changeover time in the Newsbox as well as in the individual threads, and will give you as much lead time as we can manage. This will enable us to end the slowdown ASAP.

Thank you for your patience.

Offline Dave Cullen

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #48 on: December 20, 2006, 11:27:04 PM »
new story from AP:

New Poll Shows US Military Comfortable Serving With Gay Colleagues

http://www.connexion.org/newsstory.cfm?id=7574&returnurl=index.cfm

Quote
Los Angeles, CA - U.S. military personnel are increasingly comfortable serving with openly gay colleagues, a new poll has revealed.

The poll released Tuesday by Zogby International and the Michael D. Palm Center, reveals that 73 percent of military members are comfortable with lesbians and gays.

Nearly one in four (23 percent) service members report knowing for sure that someone in their unit is lesbian or gay, including 21 percent of those in combat units.

ďTodayís poll is one more nail in the coffin of ĎDonít Ask, Donít Tellí,Ē said C. Dixon Osburn, executive director of Servicemembers Legal Defense Network (SLDN).


and that 73% is up from 13% in 1993, it says.

god. if 3/4 of the freaking soldiers are ok with it, and 79% of the public is (cited later in the story), then what the hell are we waiting for?


Offline fritzkep

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #49 on: December 21, 2006, 07:30:33 AM »
new story from AP:

New Poll Shows US Military Comfortable Serving With Gay Colleagues

http://www.connexion.org/newsstory.cfm?id=7574&returnurl=index.cfm

Quote
Los Angeles, CA - U.S. military personnel are increasingly comfortable serving with openly gay colleagues, a new poll has revealed.

The poll released Tuesday by Zogby International and the Michael D. Palm Center, reveals that 73 percent of military members are comfortable with lesbians and gays.

Nearly one in four (23 percent) service members report knowing for sure that someone in their unit is lesbian or gay, including 21 percent of those in combat units.

ďTodayís poll is one more nail in the coffin of ĎDonít Ask, Donít Tellí,Ē said C. Dixon Osburn, executive director of Servicemembers Legal Defense Network (SLDN).


and that 73% is up from 13% in 1993, it says.

god. if 3/4 of the freaking soldiers are ok with it, and 79% of the public is (cited later in the story), then what the hell are we waiting for?



The current leadership of the military still does not want to offend the noisiest opposition. There was a report on the BBC this morning (don't have a link) about the father of several sons and daughters currently at the Air Force Academy investigating an active takeover of the Academy leadership by those interested in hastening the Apocalypse. Frightening.

Mod: still can't find the link it was on either Newshour or World Today, whatever is on between 1000 and 1100 GMT on 21 December, in the last quarter hour. The BBC website appears not to have updated yet.

« Last Edit: December 21, 2006, 07:40:32 AM by fritzkep »
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Offline Castro

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #50 on: December 21, 2006, 11:03:39 AM »
Quote

The current leadership of the military still does not want to offend the noisiest opposition. There was a report on the BBC this morning (don't have a link) about the father of several sons and daughters currently at the Air Force Academy investigating an active takeover of the Academy leadership by those interested in hastening the Apocalypse. Frightening.

Mod: still can't find the link it was on either Newshour or World Today, whatever is on between 1000 and 1100 GMT on 21 December, in the last quarter hour. The BBC website appears not to have updated yet.


Here's  one link with some of the background information.
http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061216/NEWS/612160362/1326
There was a little flurry of stories last week about the "Christian Embassy" film.  As I recall, one of them said Weinstein comes from a military family, but I wouldn't swear to that.  You'll be able to google up more information.

It's very scarey.

Offline graylockV

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #51 on: February 28, 2007, 11:17:15 PM »
Here's a link to a story about one of the first Americans - if not THE first - to be wounded in Iraq.  A marine who lost his leg.  Now he's coming out of the closet to testify in favor of repealing Don't Ask Don't Tell.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/02/28/gays.military/index.html

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Offline phrag3

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #52 on: March 01, 2007, 06:53:02 AM »
He was interviewed by Anderson Cooper last night.

Offline Castro

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #53 on: March 01, 2007, 09:55:56 AM »
fritzkep said
Quote
The current leadership of the military still does not want to offend the noisiest opposition. There was a report on the BBC this morning (don't have a link) about the father of several sons and daughters currently at the Air Force Academy investigating an active takeover of the Academy leadership by those interested in hastening the Apocalypse. Frightening.


There were a number of US stories about the fundamentalist influence in recent months.  Try Googling something like "Air Force Academy religion."  Something is sure to turn up.  Also, Google News may have the particular article you read - they link to English-language papers outside the US.

ETA: Here's a post by Alva in the Huffington blog:  http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-alva/dont-ask-dont-tell-fr_b_42310.html
« Last Edit: March 01, 2007, 10:10:39 AM by Castro »

Offline Boris

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #54 on: March 01, 2007, 12:58:32 PM »
He was interviewed by Anderson Cooper last night.

His name is Eric Alva. His testimony in front of congress:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYUxGwTlshY
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Offline graylockV

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #55 on: March 16, 2007, 02:04:42 AM »
Isn't it amazing how these right-wing Republicans wake up to the truth AFTER they are out of office:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/13/AR2007031301507.html

A former Wyoming senator.  Do you suppose he paid a visit to Brokeback?
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Offline jpq716

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #56 on: March 19, 2007, 02:53:28 PM »
Please pardon my ignorance, but I have never been able to understand why a gay person would have the slightest desire to serve in the military.

Itís not merely because the military is a violently homophobic place, in which gay people run a real high risk of harm, even death, if they do not remain totally in the closet. Itís also because the military, like foreign espionage and domestic law enforcement, is increasingly an instrument of the small global plutocracy that is attempting to neo-feudalize the world in the interests of its own power, profit and, yes, even pleasure. What upstanding human being, not to mention upstanding gay human being, would want to lift a finger to support that? And does it matter in the end if a gay person gets tire-ironed for being gay or merely for being poor? The tire iron delivers the same blows in either caseÖ

Now, of course, I am not saying that we donít need armies, police forces and spy rings. Human nature being what it presently is, of course, we need them. Itís just that the armies, the police forces and spy rings that we presently have are being led by psychopathic criminals who hate the people whom they are theoretically sworn to protect and who are willing, repeatedly willing, to deal with the enemies whom they are supposed to fight at the expense of the people whom they are supposed to serve. Itís the old story, again and again: the cops and the robbers joining together to fleece the sheep. What upstanding human being would want to support that arrangement? What upstanding gay human being would want to support that arrangement? It totally beats me. Forget "donít ask, donít tell." How about "donít join, donít sell?"
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Offline Dave Cullen

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #57 on: March 20, 2007, 02:44:11 PM »
Please pardon my ignorance, but I have never been able to understand why a gay person would have the slightest desire to serve in the military.

Itís not merely because the military is a violently homophobic place, in which gay people run a real high risk of harm, even death, . . .

. . . Itís also because the military, like foreign espionage and domestic law enforcement, is increasingly an instrument of the small global plutocracy that is attempting to neo-feudalize the world in the interests of its own power, profit and, yes, even pleasure.

. . . Itís just that the armies, the police forces and spy rings that we presently have are being led by psychopathic criminals who hate the people whom they are theoretically sworn to protect . . .

wow. those are a whole lot of wild claims, with zero evidence. where do you come up with this stuff?

i served in the army and have several friends right there, and overall, i'd say this is a ridiculous overstatement: "a violently homophobic place."

the rest is just nonsense venom. i don't think that sort of baseless slander against the military in a thread about them is appropriate. if you have a case, make it. you have not.

i would probably have read right past it, but the opening statement i hear frequently, and it just really irritates me. aside from the policy, why would any gay person be more or less inclined to want to serve than a straight person? what the hell do they have to do with each other? your post sheds absolutely no light on that--all it sheds light on is why you would not want to. you are not everybody.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2007, 03:06:20 PM by Dave Cullen »

Offline Dave Cullen

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #58 on: March 20, 2007, 02:51:30 PM »
Isn't it amazing how these right-wing Republicans wake up to the truth AFTER they are out of office:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/13/AR2007031301507.html

A former Wyoming senator.  Do you suppose he paid a visit to Brokeback?

well, i'm just happy he's come around eventually.

i think we should be encouraging these people. simpson is highly respected within his party, and to publish that op-ed in the wash post under his own byline is huge. plus, he makes a really strong case.

the country's inabillity to recruit enough soldiers for the missions our Fearless Leader have gotten us into is becoming a huge issue, and may actually present an opening for us gayguys. and our linguistic and cultural ignorance in particular may be the biggest thing going for us. the country is most likely to change the policy when two things happen: 1) when enough of the public supports the change, and 2) the military actually needs us. #1 has happened, but congressmen are still way too wimpy to go out on a limb to demand our rights. they need an excuse, like an actual need. hopefully, they have one. it may still take a few years--but people like simpson are helping. and he provides lots of cover for other senators. if they can say they're just sharing his stance, that helps.

Offline Dave Cullen

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Re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell: Gays, friends, and the military
« Reply #59 on: March 20, 2007, 02:56:15 PM »
Meanwhile, Gen. Pace's comments were outlandish.

This was the HRC's email:

Quote
Yesterday, Gen. Peter Pace, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told The Chicago Tribune that he supports the Pentagonís ďDonít Ask, Donít TellĒ ban on gays serving in the military because homosexual acts ďare immoral,Ē and compared it to an adulterous affair with the spouse of another service member.

 

Itís this kind of blind prejudice against the estimated thousands of gay and lesbian military personnel that defend our nation each and every day that is truly immoral.

In fact, Sen. John Warner, R-Va., ranking member on the Senate Armed Services Committee issued a statement today opposing Gen. Pace's comments. "I respectfully, but strongly disagree with the chairman's view that homosexuality is immoral," Warner said.

 


Earlier this month, I announced that I am a gay American as I stood with Rep. Marty Meehan (D-MA) to introduce the Military Readiness Enhancement Act, legislation to repeal ďDonít Ask, Donít Tell.Ē† It was one of my proudest moments when I told Americans across the country that my sacrifice as the first US military wounded in Iraq was for all Americans, including members of the GLBT community.† †
 

Please join me in sending a message to Gen. Pace and our nationís leaders that this type of discrimination is wrong.

 

I urge you to contact the Department of Defense and the White House today to demand that General Pace apologize for his bigoted remarks.† You can use the talking points at the bottom of this email to help compose your messages.†

Yours,

Sgt. Eric Alva (ret.)

Talking Points:
The vast majority of Americans support the right of service members to serve openly and honestly, and the majority of service members are comfortable serving alongside gay and lesbian troops.
Judging gay men and women in the military for factors unrelated to their willingness and ability to serve our country undermines our militaryís effectiveness.
"Don't Ask, Don't Tell" poses exorbitant costs to the military and nation.
This kind of prejudice is going to continue to have a direct impact on our national security as we fire qualified gay, lesbian and bisexual members of the military for no good reason.
General Paceís bigotry must be condemned and he should immediately apologize to the nation and the estimated tens of thousands gay, lesbian and bisexual individuals currently serving in the military.
President Bush should also demand an apology from General Pace.

Please contact one of the below. I just sent Sen. Warner a msg. He really needs out support. Thanks.

d

To contact the Department of Defense, go here: http://www.defenselink.mil/faq/comment.html
To contact the White House, email: comments@whitehouse.gov
To thank Senator Warner for his comment, click here.  http://warner.senate.gov/contact/contactme.cfm
To take further action, please contact your Representative and encourage them to become a co-sponsor of the Military Readiness Enhancement Act, legislation to repeal ďDonít Ask, Donít Tell.Ē 

Here's what I sent to Sen. Warner:

Quote
Sen. Warner,

Thank you so much for your quick and courageous stand against Gen. Pace's comments on homosexuality. You're a good man.

I'm a gay man who served as a private and a lieutenant in the Army in the 80s, and I was proud to do it.

Gen. Pace is entitled to think that homosexuality or anything else is immoral--but it is not appropriate for him to express that. He may well feel that other religions are immoral, but if he were to announce that Islam is immoral, there would be outrage. Similarly, if he were to say that inter-racial marriage between service members were. I'm sure that if we examined his life, we could find instances of immorality. I think it is disgraceful for him to condemn a whole class of people this way. And remarks like that just push us further back into the past where bigotry against gays is acceptable.

Thank you for being one of the first prominent officials to take a stand against these remarks. You have my gratitude.

Respectfully,

Dave Cullen
« Last Edit: March 20, 2007, 03:03:11 PM by Dave Cullen »