The Ultimate Brokeback Forum

Author Topic: BBM General Discussion 2  (Read 508926 times)

Offline gattaca

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2670 on: June 21, 2022, 07:38:20 AM »
The first day of filming on BBM slipped up on me this year.  The anniversary is 14 Jun 2004.   V.

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2671 on: June 21, 2022, 04:13:48 PM »
Thanks for the reminder, V!

Offline lislis

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2672 on: July 06, 2022, 02:00:25 AM »
https://www.queerty.com/ten-movies-straight-actors-played-gay-ok-20220703

I have 5 of these movies, the Fun Fact about Heath is interesting.

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2673 on: July 23, 2022, 09:01:34 PM »
Video on "Building A Character" regarding Ennis Del Mar.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKQfJMoyeT4

Offline gattaca

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2674 on: July 24, 2022, 07:15:46 AM »
^^ WOW!  Thanks for posting that interview.  IDK they had edited out scenes where Ennis was smiling at Alma or was expressing or touching her in a positive sense.   The fact that the Lee and the editor left in the scene where Ennis sees Jack from the upstairs window, _smiles_, and then tears down the steps into Jack's arms... was amplified by those decisions to present so much of Ennis's inner struggle and turmoil in just the short time prior to Jack's arrival.  V.   
« Last Edit: July 24, 2022, 12:51:34 PM by gattaca »

Offline Lyle (Mooska)

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2675 on: July 24, 2022, 11:43:00 AM »
Yes, very true, Vincent!

This was a great find, Chuck, I've always been somewhat curious about Dylan Tichenor, as he replaced the original editor, Geraldine Peroni.

The beginning of the above video says "Part 1," so I've been searching for Part 2. Here it is:

Editor Dylan Tichenor, ACE on Audience Interpretation in "Brokeback Mountain"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYxCGhkTzgs


Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2676 on: July 24, 2022, 11:49:53 AM »
Yes, very true, Vincent!

This was a great find, Chuck, I've always been somewhat curious about Dylan Tichenor, as he replaced the original editor, Geraldine Peroni.

The beginning of the above video says "Part 1," so I've been searching for Part 2. Here it is:

Editor Dylan Tichenor, ACE on Audience Interpretation in "Brokeback Mountain"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYxCGhkTzgs

I meant to look for Part 2, and got sidetracked.   Thanks Lyle!

Offline gattaca

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2677 on: July 24, 2022, 12:58:00 PM »
^^^ Thanks to you both for part 2.  That phone call - the editing was succinct and direct between the two loves of Jack's life.  They were having a first and final confrontation and for Laureen - a stunning realization / confirmation.  To this day, Laureen's well-rehearsed explanation of Jack's death, is then summed up with, " ...about the ashes, I mean" then she abruptly hangs up without saying "good-bye" to Ennis.  That whole passage sends chill bumps up/down my spine.  Consider, she's speaking with Ennis, whom she _now_ realizes is Jack's lover of decades.  The audience's context, until this point, is we assume _maybe_ she knew.  Here we are shown maybe Laureen did _not_ know about Ennis being Jack's long-time love - i]maybe for the first time?[/i]   We see, in just a few seconds Laureen's:  love/hate, warm/cold, sad/angry, which transforms into heartbroken, jealous, angry, bitter.   Notice - she said, "the ashes" and not "his ashes"... ?  Damn.  V.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2022, 05:31:49 AM by gattaca »

Offline killersmom

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2678 on: July 24, 2022, 06:55:41 PM »
I did find part 2 as it came up on a small window at the end of part 1, so I was able to watch it as well. They are both so moving and so gut wrenching, especially the phone call. I had remembered Laureen's eyes welling up and then her abrupt hanging up. To me, it was then that her suspicion's about Ennis and Jack were proven true.
"Life can only be understood backwards. Unfortunately, it must be lived forward."
... Kierkegaard

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2679 on: July 24, 2022, 07:34:33 PM »
I never thought that she had any suspicions about them, until that phone call.  When Ennis mentions that they knew each other before Jack meeting her, I think a light bulb went off for her.

Offline killersmom

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2680 on: July 24, 2022, 07:46:33 PM »
It might not have been conscious on her part, but being a woman, and knowing how women think, I believe in her subconscious she had thoughts that something was going on.
"Life can only be understood backwards. Unfortunately, it must be lived forward."
... Kierkegaard

Offline gattaca

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2681 on: July 25, 2022, 05:33:18 AM »
^^^ Agree, that call revealed to both the audience and Laureen, the truth of Jack's "fishing trips all these years...."   V.

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2682 on: August 06, 2022, 11:16:43 AM »

Hiya UBF members.

While searching around Google, I found a site that poses 8 questions.  The site seems to be geared toward the short story, but I see no reason that they can't be applied to the movie as well.

I'll post one question at a time, to keep the posts focused on it.

When I post the 8th question, I'll post the link to the website, and edit the prior posts to add the site link to give it the proper credit.

Not sure if these topics have been discussed before.   Perhaps these will be new topics.


1.  What is it about Jack and Ennis that makes them unable to resist each other? Does Brokeback Mountain have something to do with it? If so, why does their passion continue well after they leave Brokeback?

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2683 on: August 06, 2022, 12:43:21 PM »
1.  What is it about Jack and Ennis that makes them unable to resist each other? Does Brokeback Mountain have something to do with it? If so, why does their passion continue well after they leave Brokeback?


I have to say, I've never really decided on why Jack and Ennis were unable to resist each other.   The one thing that sticks out to me is that they were kindred spirits, so to speak.  If you look at their childhoods, they were both lonely, and both lived in poverty.   These were both common points they shared with each other.   Later, when Jack married Lureen, that gave Jack financial stability he was missing most of his life.  This also led to Jack having a different social circle after marrying into Lureen's family, but Ennis was someone who would understand where Jack came from.  As an adult, Jack would still be affected by his childhood experiences, and since Ennis was still in that situation, Jack would still be able to relate and understand Ennis.

While the location of Brokeback could be seen as an Eden in both the movie and SS, did Brokeback actually have any part of their relationship?  Jack seemed to think so, as evidenced by his comment "So what we have now, is Brokeback Mountain!"

Perhaps Brokeback represented safety to them, especially Ennis, who would only be close to Jack out in the middle of nowhere.

Offline gattaca

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Re: BBM General Discussion 2
« Reply #2684 on: August 06, 2022, 01:52:06 PM »
a) BBM represented solace and reasonable safety to be truer to themselves without the prying, judgmental eyes of the world on either of them.

AKA, Ennis's comment to Jack, "if this _thing_ grabs hold of us - the wrong place, the wrong time - we are dead!" 

The mountain provided a safety zone for "boys will be boys" rough housing, horseplay, drinking and overall male bonding to where you are stuck in this situation - make the best of it. 

b) Spending months on a job when there's only 1 other person mostly 24/7 is just such a situation for more trust to develop. When you eat, sleep and work in those situations, you will learn things about that other person you may have never learned otherwise during a more time-limited setting such as dinner or drinks for a few hours or on weekends.   You gotta do something to "pass the time".  Some people never let the walls down - ever.   It took Ennis a long while as in Jack's comments about "those are more words than you've said...."   Trust is essential for any sort of "bromance" situation to develop - not unlike combat.  Their relationship, went to another level and cross lines most dare not.

c) BBM is where Jack and Ennis bonded on a trust and a physical level. "Up on Brokeback", may be the first time Ennis was able to express that side of his being - ever.

d) Their passion continues after they left BBM b/c they fostered it with fishing trips.  It's clear when they came down, neither wanted to really "let go" and "get on with their lives separately."  They did that out of necessity. 

e) It's rarer than we think but when one finds that "special person" who makes you feel alive and loved and needed like you never have before - that relationship becomes unique and different from everyone else.   Jack did that for Ennis.  Some people, as Chuck says, call these "soul-mates"  When we are lucky enough to encounter one - it's hard to shake that "knowing" - no matter the gender.  Many of us pass through life "settling" for what feels good or what plays best with the family, or the "church" or the community image. 

f) If Ennis had never met Jack and they had not spent all those days on BBM together, bonding, and then gotten drunk that cold frosty night, Ennis might have never allowed that side of himself to surface.  That image of "Earl", the raw fear from what his daddy implied he and others did to "Earl"... "drug him around until his dick fell off..." because he was a homosexual always was forefront in Ennis' mind.

f) I may think of more...

V.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2022, 05:14:49 PM by gattaca »