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Poll

What period of gay history would you like to discuss first?

The fifties and sixties - before Stonewall
9 (50%)
Early Gay Liberation 1969 - 1975
2 (11.1%)
Political awakening 1975 - 1981
0 (0%)
The onset of AIDS 1981 - 1996
6 (33.3%)
Post Protease Inhibitors 1996 - Present
1 (5.6%)

Total Members Voted: 14

Voting closed: February 24, 2007, 01:59:08 AM

Author Topic: Gay History -- How We Got Here  (Read 414278 times)

Offline michaelflanagansf

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1695 on: September 29, 2021, 02:39:20 PM »
I read it now again - many thanks, Michael!

Just seeing this now! [Sorry!] Thanks Ingy.
I do my thing, & you do your thing. I am not in this world to live up to your expectations, and you are not in this world to live up to mine. You are you and I am I, and if by chance we find each other - it is beautiful. If not it can't be helped.

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Offline tfferg

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1696 on: September 29, 2021, 04:00:12 PM »
Of course, my references are all U.S. centric...  1940-1990 is a rather large span of time where things could be much different from one end to the other.

In terms of gay people finding each other, the Allan Berube book COMING OUT UNDER FIRE shows how gay people came to find each other, either enlisting or being drafted into WWII. And then how the military dealt with them. There's also a documentary on this subject, same title, by Arthur Dong. (Same title.) From reading that book it became clear that there was not a general consensus or experience for these people, depending on the situations and locations they were. Some had really harsh experiences and others varying amounts of freedom.

As for "LGBT people of different genders entering a marriage with each other to avoid exposing their true sexual orientations"...  In the 1970's I met a gay guy who had been in the air force and the air force was investigating a female enlistee who was thought to maybe be lesbian (she was) and he married her. And, I suppose since marrying a man was never thought to be a possibility for him, they remained married and in various stages of contact over the years. The investigation stopped after they were married.

...for what it's worth.


There have been people of my generation here who I know who have been in heterosexual marriages that ended after the man came out.

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1697 on: September 29, 2021, 04:33:47 PM »
I have a friends that were married and then they divorced and came out.

Offline tfferg

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1698 on: October 02, 2021, 08:33:46 PM »
In the 1980s and early 1990s there were gay hate murders in Melbourne, Brisbane, and Adelaide, but many many more in Sydney even after homosexuality was belatedly decriminalised in New South Wales in 1984.

Bashings and murders were committed over the Sydney area, but there were many at gay beats on the clifftops around Manly and the clifftop walk and parks between the famous Bondi Beach and Tamarama.

In most cases, the New South Wales police dismissed the deaths as suicides and failed to investigate them properly. The families of the murdered men spent decades trying to get the authorities to investigate properly and pressed the Coroner's Courts to reopen inquests. A book on the murders, Bondi Badlands  was published by Greg Callaghan in 2007. I  read Stories in the gay press.

An 18-mnnth NSW parliamentary inquiry , Gay and Transgender Hate Crimes between 1970 and 2010, reported its findings earlier this year that the NSW Police Force failed its responsibility. There is now a campaign for a full judicial inquiry.

Yesterday a podcast series Bondi Badlands, was launched.




Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1699 on: October 02, 2021, 09:42:32 PM »
Thanks for that post, Tony.   It often seems that when the victims are gay men, investigations are slow to start, if they ever start at all.

Offline gattaca

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1700 on: October 03, 2021, 06:02:06 AM »
^^^^  The blatant, rampant indifference for human life, other than your own or your "own kind" is depressing, horrifying.  I dearly hope, on the brighter side, karma will balance those ends with justice.   Stay safe, stay alive.  Peace. V.

Offline CellarDweller115

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1701 on: October 03, 2021, 07:30:42 AM »
^^^^  The blatant, rampant indifference for human life, other than your own or your "own kind" is depressing, horrifying.  I dearly hope, on the brighter side, karma will balance those ends with justice.   Stay safe, stay alive.  Peace. V.


I often wish that I could see karma do her thing.  Sometimes it happens, and sometimes it doesn't.

Offline frokes

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1702 on: October 09, 2021, 04:35:23 PM »
Of course, my references are all U.S. centric...  1940-1990 is a rather large span of time where things could be much different from one end to the other.

In terms of gay people finding each other, the Allan Berube book COMING OUT UNDER FIRE shows how gay people came to find each other, either enlisting or being drafted into WWII. And then how the military dealt with them. There's also a documentary on this subject, same title, by Arthur Dong. (Same title.) From reading that book it became clear that there was not a general consensus or experience for these people, depending on the situations and locations they were. Some had really harsh experiences and others varying amounts of freedom.

As for "LGBT people of different genders entering a marriage with each other to avoid exposing their true sexual orientations"...  In the 1970's I met a gay guy who had been in the air force and the air force was investigating a female enlistee who was thought to maybe be lesbian (she was) and he married her. And, I suppose since marrying a man was never thought to be a possibility for him, they remained married and in various stages of contact over the years. The investigation stopped after they were married.

...for what it's worth.

Hey there Lyle (Mooska)! I am sorry I did not catch up on this thread until now but here is my late reply. It is very kind of you to contribute with your insight! Sounds like the guy you met who had been in the air force came up with a good solution then, given the situation!

Yes I realise that it is a large timespan. I e-mailed the National Norwegian Archive for Queer History and they kindly sent me information about persons who were believed to be LGBT and seemingly having entered facade marriages. I think I have enough research material for my main plot so now I am brainstorming to find something to make a subplot story.
An affair with the G train, he smirked into the floor, his eyes filling with tears. - The Bellwether

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Offline Lyle (Mooska)

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1703 on: October 09, 2021, 05:14:31 PM »

Good luck with this!

Offline frokes

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Re: Gay History -- How We Got Here
« Reply #1704 on: October 10, 2021, 02:50:10 PM »
Thank you very much, Lyle (Mooska)!
An affair with the G train, he smirked into the floor, his eyes filling with tears. - The Bellwether

"Jack felt D hard beneath his hand. He leaned his forehead against Ds again. You feel it, he whispered, barely breathed, not really a question." - Zero at the Bone