All-Time Favorite Films

[Katie of Sweden]

In my opinion, the scene in Jack's parents' house struck me as achieving the same kind of artistry and intensity of some of Bergman's work.  In the framing and the lighting, and the spare soundtrack, it reminded me of scenes from Fanny or Cries and Whispers.

I thought of it!! Especially the Jack's house interior is very much Bergmanish'!

[jayiijay]

TOM and KATIE:

Yes, I thought of it too, although not until the second time I saw the film.  But not Cries or Fanny - Shame & The Silence.  There is even a cabin in the former that reminds me of the Jack's-parents-scene.  Brokeback also evoked Carl Dreyer (Ordet, Days of Wrath and even Gertud, to a less degree) and Robert Bresson - possibly my favorite director - the stark framing of A Man Escaped and Mouchette.  But Brokeback moved me even more, because the film didn't start in Jack's parent's house, and the trailer, it ended there.  Bergman and the others present the bleak throughout, Brokeback takes us down.  However, if you mean just the artistry, then yes, the way the film orally and visually shrink together matches almost anything I've ever seen.  Much more impressive than the flashy film school b.s. that dazzles so many, all form, no substance.  What a movie.

[paintedshoes]

There you go, Jay, being all literate about film and stuff.  Puts me to shame.  Did you study film?

[jayiijay]

PAINTEDSHOES:

LOL.  You are nice.  Obviously I've seen a lot of movies, but have made it a point to see virtually everything on the world's best movie lists, like Sight & Sound, Cahier du Cinema, Cinemateque Belgique, plus a number of terrific web sites that compile lists of great films. The way I see it, if I'm gonna take the time see a movie, I might as well take a chance on something that others who have studied film consider good, and 9 times out of 10 I have seen way.  So in a way, yeah, I guess I do study film, by seeing the great ones.  As you know, the more you see, the more you learn, the better a "judge" you become.  Occasionally I just don't get it - like Antonioni's L'Avventura, in the 60s considered in the top 5 films ever made, still in the top 25 - plodding, dull.  But thanks to these lists, and the good fortune of being in a classic-film-friendly city (NYC), plus VCR's, I've gotten to know a lot of amazing stuff.  I hope that's not totally snobby, it's not meant to be, it's just like studying anything else, whether it be literature, physics or music: practice, LOL.  Of course I have my own sensibilities like anyone else.  For example, you'll never see "What's Up, Doc?" on any great movie lists, but it is in my personal 100, makes it me laugh.

Also,  I know a bad film when I see it, and Crash is a bad film.  Needless to say I respect anybody's right to say they enjoyed it - like I said, everyone has their own sensibilities - but as a work of art, I believe in using objective standards.  To state the most obvious, Citizen Kane is a masterpiece.  It may bore some, fine, but if they say it's bad, well, they're as wrong as people who think 1 + 1 = 3 (in base 10 - haha).  Anyone who knows anything about film will tell you that.  Then, it gets a bit less obvious - Au Hasard, Balthazar (Bresson) and The Passion of Joan of Arc (Dreyer) are great - again, a fact.  People don't always get to see these films, they are harder to find, so those who study them know, and will concur.  There's maybe 50 to 100 films ever made that fall into this category, and after that, reasonable movie-educated types will debate.  So, once again, Crash is a bad film.  When you look at the lists of the nation's top film critics, virtually all agree.  Sorry, I'm a broken record, but I'm still kind of having a problem with what happened on March 5th!!  As soon as I have time, I'm going to start posting my personal analsyses of Oscar history decade-by-decade, arguing the Academy is wrong about 75-80% of the time.  Misery loves company.  Thanks again PS.

[Katie of Sweden]

I wouldn't know about Bergman if I wasn't Swedish... Except for Fanny & ALexander, Bergman really sucks... IMO.

[Casper]

Regarding "The Passion of Joan of Arc," I own the Criterion version on DVD.  It was amazing to learn how an original copy of the movie was found in a Norwegian mental institution in 1981.  This movie was made in 1928 and the tears flowing down Joan's cheeks is so moving.  Wonderful movie!

[jayiijay]

CASPER:

Isn't it amazing how some of the best movies ever made are lost and found?  In addition to Passion, just a few years ago they found the original print of Grand Illusion, restored and re-released it in theaters to sell-out crowds (I forget where they found it - not as colorful as Passion).  As for Passion, in my personal top 5, with Falconetti's performance the greatest ever captured on screen by anyone .  A shame it's the only film she ever made, her story is a sad one, but won't get into it, too many spoilers!  thx

[paintedshoes]

Jay, thank you so much for your thoughtful and insightful comments.  I have always loved movies, and film, as they are often not the same thing, as you know.  I have not seen, or understood many of the films that you mentioned, though I am familiar with, and loved, "The Passion of Joan of Arc".  My taste often runs more wide than deep, so I appreciate someone with your knowledge and understanding.  Thank you.

What films, or movies, would you like to discuss now?  I look forward to your suggested comments on the Oscar wins.  I, too, have often disagreed with the winners, though our reasons may differ.

I would love comments from others also.

[Casper]

CASPER:

Isn't it amazing how some of the best movies ever made are lost and found? 

True!  I own "Metropolis" that has been restored but there is still footage that has never been retrieved.  I also learned that 15 minutes from "The Bride of Frankenstein" has never been found. 

This "Passion of Joan of Arc" is indeed a cinema classic.

[Casper]

What films, or movies, would you like to discuss now?  I look forward to your suggested comments on the Oscar wins.  I, too, have often disagreed with the winners, though our reasons may differ.

I would love comments from others also.

My grudge with the Academy goes back to 1974.  I was furious that THE EXORCIST did not win Best Picture of the Year.  Practically everyone I speak to agrees with me that THE EXORCIST should have received the Best Picture Award.  It won the Golden Globe Award for Best Picture and even Linda Blair won Best Supporting Actress Award at the Globes.  THE EXORCIST was the highest grossing film and so many movie critics were placing their bets on this film to win. 

I see striking similarities between this year's loss with BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN and THE EXORCIST.  There are definite parrallels to 1974 and 2006.  Many AMPAS members were scared to see THE EXORCIST as they were with BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN.  If THE EXORCIST would have won Best Picture, it would have been the first horror movie to cop that coveted prize.  The Academy still has a hang-up with a horror film winning Best Picture.  Likewise, if BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN would have won Best Picture, it would have been the first gay-themed movie to have won Best Picture award.  As of now, the Academy has refused to award any gay-themed movie with a Best Picture Award.  Both screenwriters had scornful words at the losses of their movies.  William Peter Blatty blasted the Academy for not choosing THE EXORCIST because he knew it was the better film.  Annie Proulx blasted the Academy for not choosing BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN because it was the better movie.

Many Academy members were "fraidy cats" to look at BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN and the same scenario existed for THE EXORCIST.

[johnk]

[Many Academy members were "fraidy cats" to look at BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN and the same scenario existed for THE EXORCIST.

I totally agree with you conceptually, but "The Exorcist" was up against "American Graffiti" (a well done feel good movie) and "Cries and Whispers" (my personal favorite, but you don't feel good at the end).  I liked"The Sting," but I feel that any of the above mentioned films could have easily taken an Oscar.  JMVHO.   Oh and BTW, if "Brokeback Mountain" had been featured in 1973 instead of 2005, this country would be a very different place.

Prego,  johnk

[jayiijay]

Interesting analogy re: THE EXORCIST & BROKEBACK, thanks.  I'll add another factor in support of CASPER'S contention:  1973 was the only other year a non-Golden Globe Best Picture nominee won the Oscar.  However, unlike Crash, which was simply deemed unworthy of the top 5 dramas by the Hollywood foreign press (in favor of Brokeback, Good Night & Good Luck, Constant Gardner, Match Point and A History of Violence - great group), they say there was category confusion over The Sting's omission, was it a drama or comedy?  Plus, The Sting won the major director's guild award, and while slightly behind The Exorcist at the box office, was a huge phenomenon, all time top 10 (or 5?) in its day.  Plus it tied for the most nominations - 10, and it won the National Board of Review.  So, with fewer precursors split pretty evenly among The Sting, The Exorcist and Day for Night (eligible in 1974), with Cries & Whispers Oscar-eligible in '73 having won major precursors the year before (like Best Picture from the New York Film Critics over legendary films like Godfather & Cabaret), I think it is fair to say the Brokeback upset was much much bigger than the Exorcist loss - it was considered a pretty close call.  Also, I don't think one can compare voting against a film on account of being homophobic or fear of being perceived as gay friendly, vs. not voting for a film because it was a "horror" movie.

With that said, I really enjoyed The Sting, but as JOHNK said, Exorcist, American Graffiti and Cries & Whispers were all better, and are considered better by most.  Cries & Whispers almost doesn't count because it is foreign-language, which never ever wins (from 7 nominees in 78 years).  American Graffiti (winner of the Globe as best comedy) made the American Film Institute Top 100 poll in 1997, while The Exorcist (surprisingly missing from the AFI list) often makes other important lists of great films.  The Sting is beloved, but not in the same class per most.  Part of the reason it won was that Butch Cassidy lost 4 years earlier.  So, for me, I would have voted for Cries if the Academy was truly the world cinema organization it pretends to be, but since it is not, and voting for Cries would have been a throw-away vote (the reason I never voted for Ralph Nader, LOL), then to me, The Exorcist was robbed.  I am not a religious person, but the film gets under your skin.  Ellen Burstyn is kind of over the top, especially at the beginning, but as the film turns over to Jason Miller, Max von Sydow & Linda Blair, it becomes increasingly riveting.  It stays with you, the mark of good stuff.

[paintedshoes]

Jay, I find that I cannot agree with you about the Exorcist.  This is personal, only.  I do not like so-called modern "horror films" and had a tough time with "The Exorcist".  While by impartial standards, it was a great film, it does not agree with me.

[Lola]

Jay, I find that I cannot agree with you about the Exorcist.  This is personal, only.  I do not like so-called modern "horror films" and had a tough time with "The Exorcist".  While by impartial standards, it was a great film, it does not agree with me.

AMEN!  I think if that had won back then, I would have stopped watching!   The most disturbing movie I have seen to date, in my life.  And I only saw it once, that was enough.   


1973 -- THE STING

From Universal. Producers : Tony Bill, Julia Phillips, Michael Phillips. (Rated PG)
A lighthearted, enjoyable film taking place during the Depression. Two con men attempt to seek revenge on a racketeer by setting him up in a fake off-track horse betting ploy. It was nominated for 10 total Oscars, and won 7. Starred Robert Redford, Paul Newman, Robert Shaw. Directed by George Roy Hill.


THE OTHER FILMS NOMINATED : American Graffiti, Cries and Whispers, The Exorcist, A Touch of Class

Personally I would have picked American Graffiti for best pic.

[jayiijay]

PAINTEDSHOES:

What I love about your response is that you are able to separate your personal preferences from objective quality.  That is a rare thing to be able to do, I sure have trouble respecting things that don't suit my particular taste...wouldn't even know where to start with examples.  I keep separate lists: personal favorites vs. "official" greatest.  Renoir's Rules of the Game is on the latter list, it has to be, the world's critics have considered it to be top 3 the past 30 or 35 years, but it is nowhere near my personal 100.  It is artful and after three tries I finally recognized the brilliance, but top 3, over Renoir's other masterpiece Grand Illusion, no way, LOL.

Hey, if you don't already know "Black Narcissus" by Powell & Pressburger with Deborah Kerr & Jean Simmons, it is on Turner Classic Movies today at 4:15 p.m. est.  Beautiful movie!   At midnight, TCM is showing another world masterpiece, Buster Keaton's The General, another film that I great respect and admire more than I love...my personal preference (and in my top 100 is his earlier 1922 "Our Hospitality", not as highly regarded as General or Sherlock Jr., but wonderful).  Anyhow, it is only  1 1/4 hrs., a must for any serious film buff!!  After, TCM shows the excellent In Which We Serve by David Lean & Noel Coward, winner of the 1942 New York Film Critics Best Picture.  What a channel!  Off to bed, thx

P.S.  OOOPS:  It is 10 minutes later, was heading to bed, noticed The General is on NOW, I'm off a day, sorry, LOL.  If awake, catch/tape In Which We Serve.  Black Narcissus no doubt will be on again.  Sorry, thx.